Suicide Prevention with Keli Keener and Daphne Hillhouse - 27

Suicide Crisis hotline dial 988 (option 1 for veteran support)

Suicide doesn't discriminate. It touches every community, every demographic, and yes—even our churches. This deeply moving conversation with Keli Keener and Daphne Hillhouse, clinical social workers specializing in suicide prevention, reveals how faith communities can become powerful forces in addressing the suicide crisis.

When Keli and Daphne share that 49% of pastors struggle with mental illness while 47% of Americans attend church regularly, the message becomes clear: our churches are both affected by and positioned to help with this crisis. But many religious communities—particularly conservative ones—hesitate to discuss suicide openly, creating silent suffering where healing could occur.

The experts emphasize a crucial truth: loneliness is the greatest risk factor for suicide. Nearly every other risk factor—financial problems, substance abuse, retirement—connects back to isolation. This means relationship-building becomes our most powerful prevention tool. You don't need clinical training to notice someone withdrawing, to invite them to coffee, or to ask directly, "Are you thinking about killing yourself?" That question doesn't plant ideas; it shows you care enough to create space for honesty.

Resources abound for communities ready to engage: from the 988 crisis line (with option 1 for veterans) to training programs like QPR (Question, Persuade, Refer) that can equip church leaders and members with life-saving skills. The American Foundation for Suicide Prevention offers "Out of the Darkness" walks where survivors find healing by sharing stories and honoring loved ones lost.

Perhaps most powerful is the episode's personal touch, as host Kim McIntire dedicates the conversation to her beloved aunt—remembering not how she died, but how beautifully she lived. This poignant moment reminds us that behind every statistic is a person deeply loved and profoundly missed.

What role will you play in preventing suicide? Whether through direct support, volunteering, or simply breaking stigma by speaking openly, your actions matter. Because as scripture reminds us, "The Lord is close to the brokenhearted"—and we are called to be His hands and feet.

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction and Welcome
• 3:29 Meet Keli and Daphne: Social Work as Ministry
• 5:56 VA Suicide Prevention Services
• 9:31 Training Churches for Suicide Prevention
• 14:22 Recognizing Warning Signs and Taking Action
• 19:08 Resources and Community Partnerships
• 26:54 Supporting Suicide Loss Survivors
• 35:12 Final Thoughts and Personal Dedication

Transcript

Kim McIntire: 0:08

Hey everyone, welcome to the it's Time to Rise Up podcast. I'm your host, Kim McIntire. We know there are so many things you can do with your time, so we want to thank you for choosing to spend your time listening. We pray you are encouraged and blessed by what is shared today. If you're not familiar with our show, please check out our website at itstimetoriseup. org. There you will find our social media links and for our podcast platforms you can find us on YouTube, apple Podcasts, spotify and everywhere else you find your podcast. We are excited to announce that the Abide Study is now available on Amazon and Barnes Noble. The link to order is found in our show notes. The Abide Study is currently the discipleship piece of the Rise Up Movement. There's more about that on our website. But let's get to today's episode.

Kim McIntire: 0:58

I want to welcome into the studio Keli Keener and Daphne Hillhouse. I'm so glad you ladies are with us today. Thank you for being here. Awesome Thanks for having us. You are so welcome. They are here to talk about September being Suicide Prevention Month. If you or anyone you know are experiencing suicidal thoughts, dial 988. That is the suicide prevention crisis line number and we just want to encourage that. Keep that number tucked into your mind. You never know when you come across someone who may need that information Again. I'm so honored to have you both here today to talk about suicide awareness. But before we get into that topic, would you tell us a little bit about yourselves? Keli, you've been a previous guest before You're on our lead team. You manage benevolence for our conference. And just remind the listeners a little bit about yourself.

Keli Keener: 1:53

Well, I'm Keli Keener. I've been part of Rise Up for a couple years now, and so I'm just coming alongside the team to bring hope into our communities, and so that's a really big part of my heart. My husband and I have been married for over 30 years. We have three children and four grandchildren, and I have a heart for serving in the church, and that's kind of moved on to serving our communities and communities that have been marginalized by some, and so that's good, which brought me to being a social worker. So I've been a clinical social worker in the social work field for over 20 years, and so that's about the gist of me.

Kim McIntire: 2:35

Okay, thank you, Daphne. How about you Tell us a little?

Daphne Hillhouse: 2:37

about yourself. Hi, I'm Daphne Hillhouse. I am Keli's co-worker for about six or seven years now. We've known each other for a while. I'm also been married about ten years and have a stepson who is 18 and a six-year-old little daughter, who is my mini-me Totally ridiculous. We'll have her own podcast one day. For sure. That's awesome and uh, like Keli, I mean, I think we wound up working with a team of people who, uh, we came in to social work as a ministry. Uh, we, of course, we're not working within the church making money, we're working outside within the church making money. We're working outside of the church, but still in ministry, and I think that's really foundational to our team and the choices that we've made, where we put our energies, our efforts. For sure, yeah, that's so good.

Kim McIntire: 3:59

Yeah, that's so good. Well, we were talking some time back, Keli, about your heart for just raising awareness in our community and our churches about this issue. Really, that is crisis in our community and our nation the crisis of suicide. And what role does the church have, what role does the community have in helping? And really you're here to speak into that and that's your field and you've worked a lot with veterans, right? Yes, so I guess, because I know that's your background, let's talk about what the VA does to help prevent suicide. Can we just start there? Yeah, sure, Daphne.

Keli Keener: 4:27

Why don't you kind of talk about your role first?

Daphne Hillhouse: 4:31

I've been in this role of suicide prevention, working with veterans, for about nine years. The VA has a really amazing services directed toward veterans in the suicide space, if you will. It's not something that's replicated in other health care systems. So every VA has a dedicated team for preventing suicide. So that can look like providing case management for people who are very high risk for suicide. It can also, for us, means doing things like this media training our communities, training our staff for sure, creating policies that make sure we're providing all kinds of safety and services and screening for our veterans, as well as doing outreach, so making sure that people understand 988 is there 24-7, 365, it's not going away, and that veterans specifically can dial one after they've dialed 988 to go to VA staff to talk. So that's a really big part of what we do as well, as we were kind of the advertisement for the veterans crisis line. That's so good.

Kim McIntire: 5:50

Wow. What about, um, when we're thinking more in regard to church and community, because you guys are associated with va and those systems are in place. When it comes to just being a member of the community, when it comes to just being a part of the local church, whether you're here locally in the Joplin Missouri area or anywhere all over the nation, where do you begin? When it comes to prevention and help?

Keli Keener: 6:23

Well, our heart is to educate the church, the church leadership, the clergy in the church, the importance of suicide prevention training for their staff, for any leaders inside the church, and so we specifically have a clergy training that we can do for those leadership names churchgoers. There's statistics that says 49% of pastors suffer from mental illness, themselves some sort of mental illness, and 47% of Americans say they attend a church and they have a membership to a church. So we know that's a huge part of our population in America is the churchgoers, and so if we can educate churchgoers and their leadership on the need for suicide prevention, then we are conquering a section of population that maybe we haven't reached in the past.

Kim McIntire: 7:22

For sure. And if a church is wanting that training for their staff, like, what resource is there? Like how do they get connected with this training?

Keli Keener: 7:48

trained staff that will do an Operation Save training in the communities. But also there are suicide prevention grants in the community that will also do suicide prevention for agencies, for individuals. So there's a lot of opportunities.

Daphne Hillhouse: 7:58

Daphne, I know through the VA we have grants that are in the community to include a community engagement, have grants that are in the community to include a community engagement and any area mental health agency or the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention. Really, you could probably put your town suicide prevention training and it's going to pull up agencies that will provide trainings. They have all kinds of acronyms, just like we have VA SAVE. They're all kind of acronyms.

Daphne Hillhouse: 8:29

Qpr is very common question, persuade refer. None of these. They're all very generic. They don't. They're not. You know we all have, we're all human. So there's all a. There's a base there that, no matter which one you choose to do, which one's going to fit you in terms of how long it takes I mean because QPR might take an hour and a half to talk about, where there's a CIS training that takes like eight hours. So no matter what you choose, you then as a congregation or leadership, you take it and you adapt it to your, your population. You're the people that you're serving, because all of them just have that baseline of this is how we talk about suicide and prevent suicide. So they're all adaptable to whatever you need.

Kim McIntire: 9:22

So it's not difficult to find those resources if you have a heart to find them right. So it's not difficult to find those resources.

Daphne Hillhouse: 9:28

If you have a heart to find them right, they're available. Yeah, in the US it should not be hard. Now we do have. Obviously, one of the tools that we use at the VA to screen is called the Columbia Suicide Severity Rating Scale, and we teach that as part of our trainings, because it is a screen, a screener made for the community. It wasn't made for clinicians, it's made for just parents and police. That is a a screener that has been used worldwide. It is peer-reviewed and has been tried all over the world. So I would say that's the gold standard. Um, and none of, but none of these things have. There's not going to be an emphasis on any kind of spirituality of one side versus the other. They're all very neutral. So I think that's important. Choosing one is just just choose one. Yeah, okay.

Kim McIntire: 10:19

So what about when it comes to just personal relationships, and maybe you're in relationship with someone or connected to someone that you feel is struggling with suicidal ideations, or maybe even they make comments about life's not worth living? I mean, I've heard people say that and you kind of wonder okay, how serious are they with that statement? Someone said that to me a couple of weeks ago. I was just prayer walking in my neighborhood and a neighbor just was basically saying I just feel like I'm in a hopeless situation and there's not really an answer. I don't know why I'm here. Those kind of comments can cause one to wonder is this person at risk for suicide?

Kim McIntire: 11:08

So how could one of you speak into that? Are there ways, as a friend or a neighbor or a family member, that you can have an alertness or an awareness that this isn't just someone venting because they're frustrated in the moment? Right, because we've all said. I've said things like why am I even here? You know I wasn't thinking about suicide. Do you know what I mean? But there, there there is a line where obviously it is. It is an ideation. Can you guys give us some insight on how to know the difference?

Daphne Hillhouse: 11:39

I don't think you have to know the difference. I think we just we start with taking every comment seriously, because even you you're like it was kind of a flippant thing and like I don't even know why I'm here. There was still some stress or anxiety that you're feeling at that point, or else you wouldn't have said it right. So maybe you're not at the point of even thinking about taking your life, but you're at the point where you're like I need someone to help me, I need someone to talk to me, and really we can give a big list of risk factors for suicide.

Daphne Hillhouse: 12:10

There's a big list. I mean it's not A plus B equals C. It's not that easy or we would get rid of suicide, right. But it's like, if you the biggest, when I look at this big list, all of them are connected to and to loneliness. And so if you every single one of them financial problems, substance abuse, you know retirement is a big time that people think about suicide because you've lost your whole social group, you know you've lost all these, your mission and purpose, and so anything comes back to loneliness. So a person that is saying to you I don't know what there's left to live for. What they're saying is I just, I need relationship, and I think that's the biggest, because loneliness is the biggest risk factor. Social supports, family supports, sitting and talking with someone, having someone to listen to you, is going to be the biggest protective factor. So you don't have to have any training or have any kind of special discernment. I guess you just listen.

Keli Keener: 13:17

And I think you directly ask are you thinking about killing yourself, are you thinking about suicide? I think that direct question lets someone be seen and heard, and I know there's some stigma to asking that. People are like, oh, I don't want to give them that thought if they're not having that thought. That doesn't give them the thought if they're not having the thought. It's showing that they are being cared for, and so it's really important just to ask the question, and we are not asking untrained people to provide an intervention for someone that's having suicidal thoughts, but just to know how to get them help and how can I support them. I'm going to continue to be their friend. I'm going to continue to call and check on them. If I know there's times that they're more depressed, I'm going to make sure I make an extra effort. You're going to be a friend, just like you were anyways, right yeah.

Kim McIntire: 14:05

Yeah, that's so good. I'm wondering if anyone is listening now and they're a listener who is in a situation where they feel like they don't want to live, and we've given a number for them to call right. 988 is a crisis line. It's 365 days a year, 24 hours a day. It's going to be available.

Kim McIntire: 14:31

Holidays and weekends, Holidays and weekends right. What more could you speak into them If someone's listening and they're experiencing, other than call the crisis line? What could we speak into them now? Because I feel like there may be someone who just needs a word of hope.

Keli Keener: 14:48

I mean, I really believe that people that are suffering, they feel like they're suffering alone, right, it's that isolation. And then sometimes we isolate more because of that right and everything leads us to continue this cycle of isolation. And I think that the more that we can support someone, when we see someone in our churches or we see someone in the groups that we attend and we invite them, we see that they're isolating. I think, noticing the one we've talked about this in Rise Up a lot notice the one and so notice those individuals that maybe are isolating or you're seeing differences. You know we're not expecting you to be the intervention or the one that walks them through this, through every little thing, right, but to get them help. You know, if they are saying, yes, I'm suicidal, know how to get them help. You can call 988. You can take them to the nearest ER. So there's ways to offer help, right, support them, you know, ask questions, get to know them better.

Daphne Hillhouse: 15:50

Yeah for sure, I think someone, if someone's listening and Kelly said this if someone's listening now and is feeling that way, I think the point is you're not alone, that's right. Every person and we stress this when we talk with the staff that we train and with anyone. I mean we train police officers, you know, and we look at the heroes of our country, quote, unquote Right, whether it's been, I would be better off dead, so-and-so would be better off without me. I would quit hurting everyone. I can't overcome this addiction. I'm never going to dig out of this hole.

Daphne Hillhouse: 16:33

Everybody has felt that way. Additionally, most of us have probably thought about how we would kill ourselves. I mean, what would be the easiest way? What would be the way that my family wouldn't have to find me? We've all thought that, and I think the evil of suicide and the bad part of the of of mental illness is that it makes you feel like you're alone. Right, and it when, when we believe that it starts to win. And so, even if you're physically sitting alone somewhere, you're not alone.

Daphne Hillhouse: 17:13

There are people within arm's reach that have felt the way that you do, and that's why we have all this help and that's why there's people wanting to help you. You just have to find that right person, because I know it is a lot of people's experience that they'll call up a friend and that friend says the wrong thing, like they just say something that's just so off-putting and they're like, see, I don't need to be here and that's just wrong place, wrong time. Sure, you know there are people wanting and I think that's why 988 is a good place to start. Not stop, but start, because it's somebody that that's what they're there.

Kim McIntire: 17:51

Absolutely. They're there, for that's such, that's such good advice, such good wisdom. Let's talk just a little bit more about training and partnerships between churches, community and mental health organizations. I know there are some mental health organizations in most local communities. What are some that you guys are familiar with that churches could reach out and connect to?

Daphne Hillhouse: 18:15

So you're going to most areas are going to have the most common kind of federally funded community mental health centers that you can find by a simple Google search. You're probably already familiar with those there's. Also you're going to find government agencies. So there's going to be a VA clinic, there's going to be a tribal clinic or hospital Health departments a lot of times will have resources for suicide and the tribes, I think have worked more and more on suicide prevention, kind of following this path of understanding that suicide is a health issue concern.

Daphne Hillhouse: 19:03

It's not a mental health issue. Most people who die by suicide don't have never had a diagnosed mental health problem, so it's more of a health issue and that's why we screen and talk about it in all kinds of areas and not just in mental health clinics, right, but I think it's easy to connect to those people and then finding community events that are already happening. It is very common around the country to find out of the darkness walks which are put on by the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention. So those are happening all over the place. You just have to go to their website and you can always volunteer at those, have booths at those. Churches are always very welcome to those events.

Daphne Hillhouse: 19:54

Nami, which is National Alliance of Mental Illness, thank you. They have their own kind of walks as well, but they also have support groups that people can be part of or can lead. So those are two really good organizations to just get involved in and see how the church can fit into those that are already there and is it true that I don't know if it's called NAMI?

Kim McIntire: 20:20

is it NAMI? Is that how you say it? Is it true that that is a resource for family members who are experiencing who they're maybe their sibling or parent or child or friend is dealing with mental illness but it helps them to know how to cope and how to function in that relationship in a way that is healthier? Yes, and without that support? Okay, because I feel like a friend of mine once had told me she'd gone to that support group because her sister was suffering with bipolar and I'm pretty sure that's the organization and she said it was incredible just the advice and counsel they were giving about how to handle some conflicts, you know, with someone who's struggling with mental illness and you want to have peace in your relationships as much as you can, and she was talking about how beneficial that was. So even as a family member who is just wanting to know how can I navigate relationship well in a peaceable way if my family member or friend is struggling with mental illness? So maybe that's even a side of the coin we haven't talked about that might be important.

Keli Keener: 21:26

I think so, and I think also, you know, churches have programs for substance abuse. They have, like you know, we celebrate recovery and living free ministries, and so there's ministries there to get involved in Whether you identify as having those kind of problems or those issues in your life. Go there and be a support, learn. Maybe you have a heart for people who's lost someone by suicide and so you want to support them. Start a Bible studies, just start a group. I mean, whatever your heart leads you to do, just start it. Go to your church leadership, Because I would really think that if you're thinking about it, there's others thinking about it too. Oh for sure.

Daphne Hillhouse: 22:17

And so just sometimes it just needs to be sparked. Oh for sure, those things secretive still and when we're willing to address the unmentionable, when we're willing to address those from the pulpit or from a group or from you know, and I think, when even in a small town I live in a small town and celebrate recovery, we have those. But one of the hard things about it is getting people to provide child care while someone goes and engages in that group. So maybe you're like I don't think I can sit in that group, Take care of some kids, Make some food. That's good. I mean, it doesn't have to be. All of us have a different level or a different comfort.

Keli Keener: 23:01

There's so many people with the gift of hospitality. As you're talking, I'm like, oh my gosh, that's the perfect place for someone with the gift of hospitality to come alongside a group and say I can bake cookies or I can make a casserole, or I can, you know you have gifts and talents, yeah, or someone who loves kids.

Kim McIntire: 23:16

Be like I could take one evening a week or a month to go and play with children.

Keli Keener: 23:22

You know, so I think that's a good reminder. When you're planning to do something. Look at the whole family system, Like, who are you targeting? Yes, there's an individual that needs connection, but maybe they're a part of a bigger system, Like they have children, or maybe they're caring for elderly parents, right? So what is your system? And those people in your community I don't really like that term, those people but those individuals in your community, you know how can I help them and how can I target them? And I really think, prayerfully, consider God. What do you want me to? How do you want me to act? What is my role in preventing someone's loneliness? What's my role? That's so good, yeah.

Kim McIntire: 24:00

Search your heart. What if we were all doing that? What if all believers were really taking time to say God like? What role do I play in this crisis of suicide?

Daphne Hillhouse: 24:13

Well, and that's that is how we came about to developing a training, taking the VA SAVE training and developing a training that was meant for the conservative Bible Belt church, because when we go to trainings that are focused on clergy, you always see the same type of churches and the same type of churchgoer in those trainings and it wasn't the people they don't represent, the people that we know there are more of in the Bible Belt, which is they're conservative churches and they're the churches that tend to not mention the uncomfortable things. And so we thought you know, we were already in the business of culture change around taking, talking about suicide, I mean that's you're like turning the Titanic right, like no, and because we're quickly come, I mean we've already hit the glacier, like we're going down. How are we going to turn around? So the church, like, I think, taking on, how do we and, like I already said, you know our team, it just it was a God thing that we all came together to start with, and then all five of us will like be on board for this, like nobody has to do it alone. But then to say, how are we going to change the culture of the church too? And you do that by being inside the church.

Daphne Hillhouse: 25:48

That's why I went back to church. I said how am I going to like? I came out of a. I was, I am Southern Baptist, I've been that way, I've been raised in a Southern Baptist church, went to a Southern Baptist college, but I got out of church because of being hurt by church people, and so then I was like but how can I, how am I going to, how am I going to change, promote change, when I've left this, these people in this church, right. And so that's what I got back into. Now, that doesn't mean I don't have to put up with some things that you put up with in a church, right, sure. But you can start having conversations that are tough and encourage people, because when you're talking about it, other people are like oh, that person's safe, I can go to them and then, as the safe person, you can advocate for them.

Kim McIntire: 26:39

So true, and it's a domino effect, you know. It really is in the best of ways. You know. Let's talk a little bit about the support for, or the support of, survivors. Let's talk about that. Their suicide leaves victims. It's true my life's been touched by it Not to the degree that some have been, you know, but I lost a loved one. I lost a loved one and it's not something that you really put on the back burner or that you ever forget or stop thinking about. How do you support survivors Like, let's speak into that a little bit, you guys, from your professional you know just counseling experience. What are the best things we can do to support people who have experienced that?

Daphne Hillhouse: 27:35

you can answer, but I will. I am going to say that you're right. So the average, that a suicide on average affects 136 people, oh my word for a lot of, for a lot of people, for a lot of times more than that. But the average is. So, even if that's another thing, if you're contemplating suicide, you're really not alone, because statistics tell us at least 135 people are going to be affected by what happens to you, whether that's the inner circle, like your immediate family, or all the way out to the barista you see every day at Starbucks, like somebody's going to be impacted by that.

Keli Keener: 28:15

Offering support looks like what I think you support that person by being there, knowing that they have grief right. You know, offer them support by being there, practice hospitality and also, you know, get them information about what's going on in the community. Your church may have a grief share. Your church may have a Bible study for grief right. There's lots of community resources. Get them connected with those resources. Let them again. We don't want them to feel alone either, because they're not alone in their grief.

Kim McIntire: 28:48

And I found personally that, although sometimes human nature would want to ignore or not talk about the topic, with the person impacted or affected, it's really unhealthy to not talk about it.

Keli Keener: 29:08

Right.

Kim McIntire: 29:09

Would you guys agree? Yeah?

Keli Keener: 29:10

Yeah, you know, anytime you lose a loved one, right, we check in on someone, right. So even you know, when they die by suicide, we still want to check in with them. We don't want to forget them. Nobody wants their loved one forgotten, right. And so celebrating their lives right, celebrating the things that were important to you, is really important, and that's why, if you can volunteer or attend an out-of-darkness walk, people find a lot of healing there. They go and they see other people's struggles and then they celebrate the lives of the ones they lost and they're able to share that person's story with you. And we all know that we overcome by the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony, right. And so people are healing at these events when they're sharing their stories with each other.

Daphne Hillhouse: 29:59

They wear the faces of their loved one on their shirts. Their teams are made up of their loved ones and we don't grieve well, you know, anyway in our culture. Don't grieve well, you know, anyway in our culture, and I think that is something that is unique to those walks into that culture is that they're grieving in an outward way. And when we're talking about churches and clergy making sure that we're handling suicide memorials and funerals in a really respectful way, I've seen pastors really screw it up by trying to avoid the conversation that we all know we all know we're all sitting there. We know how this happened.

Daphne Hillhouse: 30:43

There is really good guidance from the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention and several other places about how to conduct one of those, because you, you can create a wound in someone who's just suffered a huge loss.

Daphne Hillhouse: 30:58

If you don't handle one of those services well and if you don't feel equipped to do it, pass it off to someone else because, um, it can really cause prolonged grief that that person's already gonna to have complicated grief, so good, yeah, I mean just try to find that and avoiding it. I mean our team too, has had some major tragedy within our own team in the past couple of years and what we've learned about grief just among ourselves, you know, healthy individuals that we are is making sure that we are celebrating the anniversaries and talking about the people not being afraid to say remember when you told us that story, or remember when, or I bet your parent, sister, whatever would have really enjoyed. Don't avoid saying those things just because that person's not here anymore. You have to be just you. You don't. Nobody wants to forget their loved one. It doesn't matter how they died. You don't want to forget your person.

Kim McIntire: 32:03

So true, you guys have brought so much information, knowledge, clarity to this conversation and I'm really thankful because I feel like it's a conversation that needs to be happening. Are there any other thoughts you want to add to this conversation?

Keli Keener: 32:24

I just definitely want to remind everybody of the 988 crisis line number and if they're a veteran they can call 988. And when it answers, if they push one, it'll go to a veteran specific crisis line and the local VA will be notified so that the local system can follow up with them and offer those resources that are closest to them. So it's really a great thing that the partnership with the VA and the 988 hotline number so I'm just real appreciative of that partnership that happened several years ago.

Daphne Hillhouse: 32:54

And every country and we can provide that link to you for you to put in your notes. But every country, every major country around the world has a suicide hotline and they help all kinds of people. They have all kinds of training.

Keli Keener: 33:28

They have cultural specific training.

Daphne Hillhouse: 33:29

But remembering that number, and then you know it's very easy to to search VA suicide great community of thousands of suicide prevention staff who are always willing to help you. Whether it's information about veteran services and swag that has 988 all over it, or even if it's not veteran, they will find that for you.

Kim McIntire: 33:49

Okay, that's so good. I'm glad you said that about other countries, because Rise Up actually is international. It is. We have, I think, 16 international countries that are listening to the podcast and that's super encouraging because the message is going beyond the borders of our country and this is a situation that the entire world is dealing with. It's not just an issue for the United States. That's right, america.

Keli Keener: 34:17

And I think we have to remember. You know, whether you've lost someone due to suicide, or you have had suicide attempts or your, you know your mental health is declining, whatever the situation is. I just want to remind that the Lord is close to the brokenhearted Amen. He's so close and so reach out and love someone.

Kim McIntire: 34:40

Yeah.

Keli Keener: 34:41

Because we are the hands and feet of Jesus.

Kim McIntire: 34:43

He heals the brokenhearted and he binds up their wounds. It's a beautiful woman who taught me how to sing, who taught me how to sing harmony on the piano bench, who had the best laugh and the best smile of anyone I've ever known. Who had the best laugh and the best smile of anyone I've ever known would give anyone the shirt off of her own back, would never let anyone go hungry. You never left her house. You're her house hungry. She loved with all of her heart.

Kim McIntire: 35:31

She didn't know how much she was loved, but I just want to dedicate this episode to her, my sweet aunt, who I still love so much and I'm so thankful for the life that she did live, and I just felt that was appropriate to speak. It has touched my life, it's touched my whole family and this topic is very close to my heart and you guys don't know what it means to me that you said yes to come and just share all of this information, because I know there are families and friends and community churches that need to hear this message. So thank you both so much. I really appreciate your time. Thank you, friends and community churches that need to hear this message. So thank you both so much. I really appreciate your time. Thank you for taking your time to listen to our podcast. We would love to hear your feedback. Please rate, review or leave a five-star review on Apple Podcast. May God's grace and peace be with you all, in Jesus name.